Motions

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Nathan
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Motions

Post by Nathan » Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:37 am

Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:23 PM

Fellow Senators,

I have the honour of sponsoring Mr Knytling's admittance to the Senate with the following motion:

QUOTE
The Senate of the Lakes,

welcoming Vilhelm Estridson Knytling’s application for admittance to the Senate,

decides to admit Mr Knytling as a Senator of the Lakes.


Respectfully submitted,

A. Andelarion
Senator of the Lakes.
Posted 05 August 2008 - 12:16 AM
More than three days have passed, as tradition dictates, and we can safely say that Vilhelm Estridson Knytling's application for admittance to the Senate has passed.

Vilhelm Estridson Knytling is a Senator of the Lakes now. Congratulations!!
Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:10 PM
Fellow Senators,

I have the honour of sponsoring Mr Woodrow's admittance to the Senate with the following motion:

QUOTE
The Senate of the Lakes,

welcoming Scott Woodrow’s application for admittance to the Senate,

decides to admit Mr Woodrow as a Senator of the Lakes.


Respectfully submitted,

A. Andelarion
Senator of the Lakes.
Posted 05 August 2008 - 12:14 AM
More than three days have passed, as tradition dictates, and we can safely say that Scott Woodrow's application for admittance to the Senate has passed.

Scott Woodrow is a Senator of the Lakes now. Congratulations!!
Posted 10 April 2009 - 12:28 AM

Honorable Senators,

I motion to vote on Aldin Isammaður's admittance to the Senate of the Lakes.

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 10 April 2009 - 04:24 PM

This motion is passed unanimously, a vote of 4-0. Aldin Isammaður is admitted to the Senate of the Lakes.

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 16 April 2009 - 09:13 PM

I, Aldin Vanadisarson Isammaður, solemnly affirm that, as a Senator of the Lakes, I will not propose, or assent to, any proposed vote, decision or resolution, which shall appear to me injurious to the People of Hurmu, nor consent to any act or thing whatsoever that shall have a tendency to lessen or abridge the People’s rights and privileges, as declared by this Constitution and the Instrument of Rights and Liberties, but will in all things conduct myself as a faithful and honest guardian of the people, according to the best of my judgement and ability. Furthermore, I solemnly affirm that I will be true and faithful to Hurmu and that I will not, whether directly or indirectly, do any act or thing injurious to the Constitution or Government thereof. All this that I have solemnly promised, I affirm under the pains and penalties of perjury
Posted 02 June 2009 - 05:58 PM
Esteemed Senators,

One Leikari Vembriusonur has approached us seeking entrance into the Senate of the Lakes. He has recieved recommendations from myself and Senator Isammaður.

I wish to call for a vote on his admittance.

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 05 June 2009 - 03:15 PM
The 3-day voting period has ended. This motion is passed by a vote of 4-0.

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 06 June 2009 - 11:23 AM
Thank you Senators for your votes.

And now, the Oath:

I, Leikari Vembriusonur, solemnly affirm that, as a Senator of the Lakes, I will not propose, or assent to, any proposed vote, decision or resolution, which shall appear to me injurious to the People of Hurmu, nor consent to any act or thing whatsoever that shall have a tendency to lessen or abridge the People’s rights and privileges, as declared by this Constitution and the Instrument of Rights and Liberties, but will in all things conduct myself as a faithful and honest guardian of the people, according to the best of my judgement and ability. Furthermore, I solemnly affirm that I will be true and faithful to Hurmu and that I will not, whether directly or indirectly, do any act or thing injurious to the Constitution or Government thereof. All this that I have solemnly promised, I affirm under the pains and penalties of perjury.
Posted 18 June 2009 - 04:31 PM
Dearest brothers and sisters of Hurmu,

It is my feeling that, at this point in time, Hurmu and Stormark grow apart. What was once common ground is beginning to falter. I believe it is time, with all due respect for the Stormark Royalty and Nobility, for Hurmu to claim independance from Stormark. Is there anyone who shares my feelings in this senate?

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 19 June 2009 - 01:25 AM
The current state of the nation of Stormark, one revolving entirely around an Emperor who many believe should be hidden and separated from his people, is contrary to the open and transparent nature of Hurmu. I find this to be nigh on insulting, to build a wall between our brothers and sister in Stormark. We have always given due respect to the Emperor and his kin in the House of Ettlinger Freyu, they lead Stormark with dignity and fairness and have long been a friend of Hurmu's, we will not be separated from our brethren. Royalty or otherwise, we are all one people. We all walk on the same ground. We drink the same water. We breathe the same air. Let us speak among ourselves as friends and family.

Ionel Constantinescu
Posted 19 June 2009 - 07:11 PM
And yet, while the opportunity exists for this to put before the people, there is always a chance that it could be.

From time-to-time, it is the prerogative of the Emperor to decide the nature of his relationship with the people, it is the prerogative of the people to decide the nature of their relationship with the Emperor, it is the prerogative of the Empire to decide the nature of its relationship with Hurmu, and the prerogative of Hurmu to decide the nature of its relationship with the Empire, and somewhere shall they either all have a close relationship, or some shall have relationships that are less or more distant, as the balance of the order of things resumes its status quo or settles anew.

Leikari Vembriusonur
Posted 20 June 2009 - 03:30 PM
Liberty is not always about the quest of casting off tyrants, but of the freedom to choose one's own destiny. With the current subjugation to the Empire, Hurmu follows in the footsteps of a big brother. This way, we are safe, we are secure. All roads are chosen for us. What can we possibly fear?

How can we progress when roads are chosen for us? How can we choose our own paths when we follow in the footsteps of our big brother?

Family bonds are strong. We shall keep them so. Stormark has our eternal gratitude for keeping us safe and secure for a long time.

We, as a people, yearn for more. We yearn, we long, we strive – for a Hurmu that keeps developing, evolving and growing. We wish to see a stronger Hurmu, a more vibrant society and a happier place for our children to grow up in. Hurmu will evolve!

The Empire brings much good to the people of Hurmu. Stability, safety, security!

Yet we yearn for more. We wish for a Hurmu to decide her own ways to walk. We wish to make mistakes, learn from them and grow tougher. We wish to stumble, rise up and be ever prouder. We will learn our ways as an independent people. Only that way can we fully develop our own distinction and we will not be seen as a child of Stormark's, but as an adult capable of forming relationships like all others of our age.

Daniel
Posted 22 June 2009 - 06:44 PM
Aldin,
Last time we tried we ended up with only two of us. Hurmu has a lot of independence inside the Empire but it is not free. In my opinion, Hurmu is not strong enough to stand on it's own. It must grow. Hurmu may have a long and big history, but it today it is small and weak.

Polten
Posted 22 June 2009 - 09:48 PM
That piece of history is unfortunate. However... As long as this country is under the rule of a foreign land, we will not be able to grow as a nation. As long as we are associated with the Stormarkian empire, we will be seen as a Stormarkian puppet.

Daniel
Posted 28 June 2009 - 09:23 PM
Forgive my intrusion into this chamber. While I once was a Senator, I'm not sure of my current status, so I will assume I am not anymore and that I am breaking all sorts of social and legal conventions.

I was there when we made our attempt at independence, and the initial thrill was great. There was this surge of passion from a few individuals that made me believe we were going to get somewhere, soon, and stay there for a long time. However, it was not to be. Things slowed down and soon- even those people, like me, who visited Stormark's forums, neglected to visit Hurmu's. It was a terrible time.

Stormark represents a safe haven in the sea of uncertainty that is independence. Due to Stormark's permanence, there is never a chance that Hurmu will be lost or forgotten about. Further, I completely understand the worry that Hurmu is shadowed by Stormark- that we are seen as a puppet etc. Anyone who takes the time to read about Hurmu will quickly learn that, though the history of the two nations is intertwined, Hurmu is very individual and very much its own nation, and that's been as true as when we were independent as when we were hosted by Stormark.

Essentially what I'm saying is rash decisions ought not to be made, because good progress has been made in Hurmu of late (I haven't been posting, but I have been watching), and as a (former?) Hurmudan it would make me sad to see that lost because it is felt that Hurmu's longstanding ally, Stormark, "grows apart".

Vilhelm Estridson Knytling
The ghost of Nathan Waffel-Paine

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Nathan
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Re: Motions

Post by Nathan » Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:45 am

Posted 04 August 2009 - 04:26 PM
Fellow Senators,

I have the honour of bringing you the following motion for resolution and decision:

BE IT RESOLVED AND DECIDED BY THE SENATE OF THE LAKES THAT:

1. Hurmu is a free, sovereign and independent State.
2. Hurmu owes allegiance to neither Emperor nor State of Stormark, but to Hurmu's people alone.
3. The third paragraph of the Fundamental Law will from now on read “The sovereignty of Hurmu is vested in its people.”.

Done at Huyenkula this [Date]

Daniel
Posted 04 August 2009 - 07:36 PM
What are the benefits of this for Hurmu?

Aoife
Posted 05 August 2009 - 03:48 AM
We live in truly historic times - in that respect, they may very well be giving itself a fatal overdose. When the “celebrations” have died down, it will be easier to see what will happen with a cool eye.

Thorald
Posted 05 August 2009 - 03:12 PM
Aldin and I yearn to search out our own path, unconstrained by the laws of another nation. We cannot know for certain whether this venture will prove successful, but one cannot win a game if the game is not played. Hurmu, once strong in these lands, seeks to regain her former status in the international scene.

Ionel
Posted 05 August 2009 - 07:06 PM
QUOTE
Aldin and I yearn to search out our own path
Problem is that it takes much more than the 2 of you. Before you take this to a vote in the Senate, let's organize a referendum. See if there is solid rock (enough volunteers) to build the nation on.
I'm very interested in a nation that lives by the Brida but I want to know that there are more who want to fight for it.

Polten
Posted 05 August 2009 - 07:52 PM
QUOTE (Polten @ Aug 3 2009, 05:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Problem is that it takes much more than the 2 of you.

With all due respect, friend, I've seen respectable and successful micronations subsist with merely 2 members. Hurmu was founded on 2 members.

Ionel
Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:22 PM
With independence it will be easier for “outsiders” to distinguish Hurmu from Stormark. With an active Hurmu government, we can represent ourselves abroad, thereby showing the nations of the world that we do exist, that we are – despite what many people still today believe – a free, living and vibrant society. Today, unfortunately, people see Hurmu dead, or at best a Stormarkanized colony. But we are not. We are distinct from the rest of Stormark.

I hold neither evil nor grudge against the Stormarker state. It has been helpful in securing us peace, order and good government, and it is upon those foundations we stand on today, when we march for the right of the Hurmu people to self-determination in all areas of public life. For that I am sure we are all ever thank- and greatful.

But there comes a time in the course of all nations, great and small, where they, following the most basic instinct of ruling themselves according to their own beliefs, practices and culture, they must separate themselves from their mothers and fathers, or in Hurmu's case, a step-parent.

For Hurmu and Stormark, although having lived in relative harmony, are much different from each other. The very ideals of the Brida and of the royalism of Stormark cannot go hand in hand. In Hurmu, the Emperor is but an equal of me, though as Emperor he is my liege and master. These things are difficult to understand for me, and I believe separation would be best both for Hurmu and Stormark.

Why for us? Well, the culture of the Empire is vast and great, and I am afraid that we will in some way, if we do not guard ourselves, be Stormarkanized in a way not benefiting our nation. That is what happened to Celtica and Treisenberg and Nidaros – they do not exist any more. The King of Treisenberg left when he saw the irrevokable transformation of his country. I do not mean this in way critical of the Stormarkers, for they are our bloodbrothers, but they are so great in culture and traditions compared to our small country, that they will unconsciously and, I am afraid, inevitably influence us in a direction that could, at worst, let our people's way be but a regional flavour of Stormark's heartland's traditions.

This is hard for me to say, and I wish that no offence is taken by us, because we are all Stormarkers by either citizenship or association through the Huyenkula Convention. To cut the chains that bind us and instead begin a new era where Hurmu and Stormark would be but friends, equals, for all nations, great and small, are eachothers' equals.

I envision a Hurmu active both home and abroad. I am sure that deals would be made by Hurmu and Stormark, based on their particular friendship and history, that would keep the affinity between our peoples in a special way. I envision a Hurmu that would be strong in foreign affairs, so that the world would see the Brida. And at home, we would discuss the Brida at lengths, and we would make friends.

I believe that separation will benefit Hurmu. Separation would entitle Hurmu's distinctiveness a character of its own, a nation of its own, and this will charge more people to become interested in the Hurmu way of life, in the Brida and in the history and culture of our common nation.

Daniel
Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:29 PM
QUOTE (Polten @ Aug 6 2009, 06:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Problem is that it takes much more than the 2 of you. Before you take this to a vote in the Senate, let's organize a referendum. See if there is solid rock (enough volunteers) to build the nation on.
I'm very interested in a nation that lives by the Brida but I want to know that there are more who want to fight for it.

I don't know, Polten (by the way, it's good to see you again ). I don't see why an independent Hurmu would have much less activity than a Stormarkian Hurmu. The thing is, after all, up to the people of Hurmu themselves, that is, the Senators, to take and act in Hurmu's interests, which includes being active in their own right.

The Fundamental Law itself states

[§14. Membership in the Senate is open to all individuals who endeavour to serve Hurmu and Hurmu’s people, who wish to uphold Hurmu’s founding values, who strive for peace, and who are, in the judgment of the Senate, able and willing to carry out such obligation/i]

Being a Senator is not just a privelege, but an obligation...

***

As to your question of referendum, independence by amending the Fundamental Law is achieved by a vote of 2/3+1, that is 5 votes out of 6. And if that is achieved, I believe we have the people behind this motion.

However, there is also the ethico-moral question of independence versus dependence. If a majority, but not a qualified one, seeks independence, what do we do then?

Daniel

Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:52 PM
QUOTE (Aldin Isammaður @ Aug 5 2009, 08:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
However, there is also the ethico-moral question of independence versus dependence. If a majority, but not a qualified one, seeks independence, what do we do then?

Then one could try the Althing route under Article 4j of the Law on Administrative Subdivisions.

Harald

Posted 07 August 2009 - 12:51 PM
QUOTE (sovereignvikingemperor @ Aug 5 2009, 10:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Then one could try the Althing route under Article 4j of the Law on Administrative Subdivisions.

That would also require just a simple majority in stead of a qualified majority.

Aoife

Posted 08 August 2009 - 12:31 PM
Would Hurmu also move to another forum?

Aoife

Posted 09 August 2009 - 01:58 AM
My assumption is yes, we would once again move to an independent forum, but that may not be the case. Aldin and I will converse more on that matter.

Ionel

Posted 09 August 2009 - 07:09 PM
In the more than a decade that I have been involved in this hobby I have seen this over and over again. It continues to amaze me how time after time people keep inventing the same wheel with which other have driven themselves into the abyss.

The arguments raised by the proponents of independence are pretty void. All the things that the independence-mongers cite as reasons for independence can be done and dealt while being an Autonomous Country of Stormark. Simply take a look in the Law on Administrative Subdivisions if you want to see for yourself. This whole independence mongering all reeks of calling independence for the sake of independence and a desperate, mentally exhausted va banque flight forward.

To ask the other senators to along with independence-mongers' wish to leave Stormark is like asking them to trade, while being in the middle of a stormy ocean, a lavish ocean liner for a raft built of rotten wood and rusty oil drums which is being held together by a greasy rope just to cater those who want to walk the wild side.

What would happen in the event that Hurmu is quite predictable; first euphoria and a surge in activity caused by the changes that have to implemented due to her newly independent status, quickly followed by plummeting activity caused by lack of critical mass and rising apathy levels leading to at best an undead existence but most likely a quick death.

For Hurmu the choice between and remaining in Stormark and independence is the same as choosing between light and darkness, between riches and poverty, between stability and instability, between warmth and cold, between life and death.

Those who want Hurmu to live should vote against the Motion for Independence, those who want Hurmu to die should vote in favour of it.

Shall Hurmu live?

Astrid

Posted 09 August 2009 - 07:16 PM
Lady Astrid,

You have just touched my heart.

Hurmu shall live!

Aoife

Posted 09 August 2009 - 08:25 PM
You underestimate my determination, Lady Astrid, let alone that of Senator Isammaður.

Ionel

Posted 09 August 2009 - 08:56 PM
While this really shouldn't be an issue for Ms de Valois, she did once apply for membership in the Senate...

There are some poiints that she brings up... But I ask myself, and I ask you all, why would Hurmu die without Stormark?

Is it that certain senators then wouldn't bother turning up to meetings because Hurmu might be on a different forum?

Daniel

Posted 10 August 2009 - 09:32 AM
* Princess Unna sits at the public gallery and eats pop corn. *

QUOTE (Aldin Isammaður @ Aug 9 2009, 10:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There are some poiints that she brings up... But I ask myself, and I ask you all, why would Hurmu die without Stormark?

She thinks: "For the very same reason you think that Hurmu will thrive without Stormark. There is a word for that and it is called perception."

Unna

Posted 10 August 2009 - 10:13 AM
QUOTE (Aldin Isammaður @ Aug 9 2009, 10:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
While this really shouldn't be an issue for Ms de Valois

So much for Hurmu's openness.......

QUOTE (Aldin Isammaður @ Aug 9 2009, 10:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There are some poiints that she brings up... But I ask myself, and I ask you all, why would Hurmu die without Stormark?

Please re-read the comments made by others than you and Talsin in this thread and the other Hurmu Independence thread.

Aoife

Posted 10 August 2009 - 08:40 PM
My apologies, my friends, if I at all seemed annoyed or irritated with you... That was not my intention. I hate to see this issue divide our population that has been unified on so many other subjects and areas. I apologize for causing division.

That said, I believe we should try and list the pros and cons of both membership in Stormark and membership in the free community of sovereign nations, so that we can have a healthy and a hopefully objective debate on Hurmu's future. Apart from the independence and sovereignty discussion, what do we want for Hurmu? Whereto shall Hurmu be heading?

Daniel

Posted 29 July 2009 - 02:31 AM
Fellow Senators of the Lakes,

I have the honour of bringing you the following motion for resolution of the Senate,


Resolution on Lontinien and the Lósálfareyar

We long for our brothers and sisters in Lontinien and the Ljósálfareyar. For they took the Brida to themselves, and when we left them, we hoped that they would dwell freely, that their governments would be strong and be able to further their people in developing culture, wellbeing and security. We are sorry that this has not happened.

It feels for us as if our brothers and sisters in the colony of Lontinien have been neglected, forced in nonchalance from the imperial government and we have heard calls that they should be returned to the sovereignty of the one Hurmu.

We understand that the imperial government of Stormark cannot, with such vast amounts of land, focus so neatly upon one small nomadic tribe in Ghawlama and the outskirts. The nomads live their own life, Bridaically, and they wish for reunion. For under us, we hope, that neglect shall not be passed, but that the lands and people of Ghawlama and the
Jawnetka of Lontinien will flourish, blossom and come to a new spring of life.

As to our friends, brothers and sisters among the Isles of the Elves of Light, off Feanoria of the North, having dwelt under the Elentáris and Elenarans of Menelmacar, the communism of the Red Antilles, and then briefly flourished under the rule of Hurmu, to then be put and cast, like their siblings the Jawnetka, to utter neglect.

We see it that we have a responsibility for those islands and for Lontinien; we have a responsibility not to let them die, not to let their culture perish, for we need them in our hearts! We need our brothers and sisters!

Accordingly, we – the Senators of the Lakes – do hereby, by all powers belonging to us by the Fundamental Law direct the Chairman of the Senate of the Lakes to enter negotiations regarding the return of Lontinien and the Ljósálfareyar to Hurmu.

Daniel

Posted 12 August 2009 - 03:28 PM
The voting period is long gone. After eligible votes, this motion passes 3-0.

Ionel

The ghost of Nathan Waffel-Paine

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