Rebuilding the Senate - Donation Pool

[Demon of Fides]

I donate 2000ECs to the senate building fund.

- New named ocean city on the map: 3000 EC

I believe we'll need another 1000 to get it built and then some funds to connect it to the mainland (as many mainlands as possible). If after all that, there's a surplus, I put forward that it should go towards connecting the senate to my tunnels (I also plan to expand the tunnels out a bit).

[Scott Alexander]

Connect it to the mainland? Are you insane? With what? A ten thousand mile long bridge over several-mile-deep ocean?

[Octavius]

Yes?

[Demon of Fides]

We're going to have a friggin massive surplus if everyone puts in half of what I put in. If not... Tunnels.


Plato is everywhere.

[Harvey]

Connect it to the mainland? Are you insane? With what? A ten thousand mile long bridge over several-mile-deep ocean?

How big IS this region that we call Archipelago, anyway? I assumed it wasn't an entire planet's worth. The most remote islands on earth, Tristan de Cunha in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean, is 1750 miles from mainland. Nowhere close 10k.

Not saying I want to drive across a 1750 mile bridge either. But it does beg the question of the scale.

[Aryeztur]

Aryasht opposes the building of bridges. It will warp people's sense of the great distances of the world. It will negatively affect the shipping industries of many nations. It will destroy the scenic beauty of the oceans.

[Scott Alexander]

How big IS this region that we call Archipelago, anyway? I assumed it wasn't an entire planet's worth. The most remote islands on earth, Tristan de Cunha in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean, is 1750 miles from mainland. Nowhere close 10k.

Not saying I want to drive across a 1750 mile bridge either. But it does beg the question of the scale.

Eh, looks like I vastly overestimated the scale. If the map is the same size as the MCS (7 miles per pixel), then World Capital is 1960 miles from Real Diamond, the closest city.

Still, that's a heck of a bridge, it still only gets us to another island, I'm not sure I like the idea of the Favored controlling access to the capital.

[Adelene]

Hey, it looks like that program I wrote that lets me drive a ship around the map and track how far it's gone will come in handy! *plays*

I get Real Diamond being 2157 miles away, which is 4 days for a ship going at an average Perturber's pace (35mph for 15 hours a day). The nearest bit of Omega complex is 2602 miles away, also 4 days. The nearest point in Galinomai is 4094 miles away; 7 days. The nearest point in Swynndyrran Hallatekrrr us 2704 miles away; 5 days. The nearest point in Apollantis is 2648 miles away; also 5 days.

If it weren't for tellurics, I'd say that a few high-speed trains in tunnels would be reasonably realistic, assuming we could reasonably build them in the first place - the 'days' measurements assume a relatively slow pace for modern-ish vehicles; a high-speed train could easily halve any of those numbers, and 3 days on a train isn't *that* bad - but with tellurics, I don't think that works, and it could actually take quite a bit longer for a non-perturber-propelled vehicle to go through the tunnels or over the bridges if it has to be low-tech enough to get through the tellurics, and then you start having to worry about supplies and fuel...

Colony seems to have the infrastructure to pull it off, maybe - if they stick to being under the ocean and avoiding unfavorable tellurics, they should just be able to deploy whatever tech they already have for providing supplies to travelers. But for the rest of us, I don't think so - my understanding is that going by ship is easy enough (even if your statelet doesn't have ships, getting a ride with a trader shouldn't be hard, and Mevwani traders if nobody else go just about anywhere) that the costs of such an undertaking would well outweigh the benefits.

(On the other hand, if everybody *does* have their hearts set on building a route, it seems to me that a perturber could fairly easily tunnel through a low-tech area given the right kind of tool...)

[Harvey]

Giving the Favored control of the capital / access to it is the best way to ensure that it doesn't get blow up again. Just sayin'

The previous statement is not an official communique of our government.

[Rei Milharna]

Why not an airplane?

[Kallinn Ynnetrrr]

Any kind of tunnel or bridge seem entirely unrealistic unless the entire route is Tech 4 at least.

Swnndyrrân Hallatekrrr can manufacture high-speed commuter super-catamarans capable of 50knots or better. I'd suggest commuter jets, but getting that much range out of them would be stretching it.

[Rei Milharna]

IC: Not necessarily. I've seen routine flights on Þaia that were about 5000 km, nonstop.

OOC: Not necessarily. The longest nonstop flight on offer is 10,431 miles from Dominica to Australia, run once monthly on a 767.

[Orion]

The Apolline delegation suggests a pair of zip lines instead of a bridge, one for each direction of traffic. Using carbon polymer strands and lightweight sail ferries, this would be a relatively simple matter to achieve, and quite cost-effective.

OOC: Think horizontal space elevator.

[Kallinn Ynnetrrr]

IC: Not necessarily. I've seen routine flights on Þaia that were about 5000 km, nonstop.

OOC: Not necessarily. The longest nonstop flight on offer is 10,431 miles from Dominica to Australia, run once monthly on a 767.

I was thinking smaller commuter jets, like a Learjet or something, mostly because I don't expect the travel from each direction to be that heavy that we'd need a 767-equivalent.

[Shyriath]

IC:The Kennerextith delegation hereby pledges 1000 ECs to the Senate rebuilding fund. It is long past time that we participated in the affairs of the world, and perhaps this will go some way toward remedying that.

Kennerext obviously prefers that an underground route to the capital be available, but recognizes that having the Colony be in sole control of such a route would present... political difficulties. If we could also provide one, we would, but alas, even leaving aside the issue of varying tellurics on the route, our technology would be nowhere near up to the task. We would ask the Colony if they would be willing to share tunnel administration with other nations, but I suspect that this idea would not rest easy with them.

Having several alternatives is always preferable, of course. Although we aren't familiar with these "carbon polymer strands", we are intrigued by the suggestion of the Apolline delegation. And, of course, providing facilities for the Mevwani merchant-marine and other vessels should be a given in any case.

OOC: I like the idea, Ryan. Unless tellurics can degrade technologically-produced materials, it should hold up well in just about any telluric conditions, though I have to wonder what the ride would be like if a hurricane decided to blow through. Also, journeys over ocean imply a certain minimum ferry size and weight, because you'd have to have vessels that carried enough food and cargo, could sleep people, had bathrooms, etc.

[Nathan]

Merveilles will donate 1000 EC to the fund for any remaining costs.

I like the idea of the ziplines! Combined with super-catamarans, jets, and traders I think there will be ample transportation available. Perhaps each statelet can make available (gratis or for some ECs) to the other statelets its own unique transportation. Then other, lower tech/magic statelets can elect to have them installed depending on which one would make more sense to them. Building high tech zipline stations or harbors in low tech telluric zones can be explained away by something else because I feel like the telluric limitations should be there to enhance things not make things needlessly complicated (or how about the harbors are merely built in a high tech telluric sub- zone).

[Harvey]

The Favored formally refuse to pay for any upfront costs of this venture. But, recognizing that we are the closest serious civilized area to the World Capital location, we are willing to establish a transfer hub on the outskirts of Real Diamond designed to handle foreign ships and planes and transfer to them these proposed zip lines, all in a diplomatic legal-free zone outside of larger Favored law.

[Demon of Fides]

IC: Nice response from the Favoured, there. By that logic, Colony should spend the 2K on a tunnel from our network to the floating city and leave a lonely 1K in the donation pool.

OOC: The bitchyness is how Plato would response (albeit, more formally, but I'm tired), also thanks to Nathan for the donation.


Also, Ziplines put me immediately in mind of 200K long flying foxes...

[Carl Jackson]

Perhaps Safiria could set up a teleportation link between New Anhira (f/k/a Mrxa Kiščwrwm) and the World Capital?