Dissolution Act

[Verion]

This Landsraad

RECOGNISING that Shireroth has no been transformed into a desolate and godforsaken place of misery;

AKNOWLEDGING that the Northern part of our nation has been refounded as an outstretch of Stormark;

RECOGNISING that many, indeed the larger part, of Shireroth's active citizenry has seen fit to desert the Imperial Republic in favour of the recently found state of Minarboria;

EXPECTING this situation to last;

CONCLUDES that the Imperial Republic of Shireroth has lost its function as a central nation and micronational hub of activity;

CONCLUDES that there really is no need to keep this nation alive, and

RESOLVES that the Imperial Republic of Shireroth will be dissolved and dismantled in the next month.

[Fjorleif]

My Lords and Ladies,

Before us we have a Bill concerning the dissolution of the Imperial Republic of Shireroth, which has been submitted by the Lord Verion. Debate on the Bill aforesaid shall be open for at least 24 hours from the initial submission.

[Kaiseress Kizzy]

I do not see Shireroth as any more or less desolate than other places around. I do not find the resurgence of Storish culture in Elwynn distasteful at all, it is not unfounded and is consistent with its history. I don't think that many people have "fled" to Minarboria, and I don't think it matters either way as they have a very high standard they've set for themselves and probably won't/don't want to become Shireroth 2.0. I'm pleased by them and hope they thrive.

Shireroth has not been a hub or world power for awhile now and we should not continue to carry on as if we are one, it only makes us more depressed. We must stop asking ourselves "How do we fix Shireroth?" No one knows. No one can even agree what the problem is, and for sure there are more than one: people are not as tight-knit, few primary citizens, the group of people is entirely different now and most of us have little direct connection to the original founders/pioneers, disinterest in the central government, disinterest in the states, a confusing and sometimes impenetrable culture, and so on.

Yes, perhaps objectively there's little value in continuing to put effort in a community that is as jaded and tired as Shireroth. Everyone has their main countries they worry about first. However, I see no reason to dissolve something as old as Shireroth just because its lost its shine and luster and popularity. History has its place and its significance, and being "the oldest" is perhaps not in itself a testament to current talent or creativity, it is a testament to perseverance, it maintains a sense of realism on Micras, even if our power is not projected very strongly, we're still here, we'll always be here, no other country can ever claim that.

I understand dissolving ourselves, national suicide in other words, might appear to some as dignified and graceful. I don't think that's how Shireroth should be ended. To be blunt if we were to end ourselves we should have done it long ago... Babkha went out at the right time, they saw themselves on a downward trend and no one wanted or cared to invest much into saving it. We've gone past that point, that to end now would be insignificant. Shireroth is like The Simpsons... its not the best anymore, and its a shadow of its glory days, but it's ok sometimes and some people still get some enjoyment out of it, and isnt that good enough?

However, there HAS been a brain-drain, and two seemingly permanent schisms... first Kildare and now Minarboria. It does feel like those of us still primarily in Shireroth have been "left behind". I understand its hard to go on when everyone seems to be telling you that you're old, no fun, corrupt, bloated, ineffective, and so toxic that they need to physically and virtually relocate themselves. However, I'm still getting some enjoyment out of my time here in Shireroth. And while I hate to degrade the mango throne as is so popular these days, I am looking forward to returning to Demonsfall when my customary 100 days are up at the end of this month.

[Fjorleif]

My Lords and Ladies,

Shireroth cannot be dissolved without repealing the whole Charter of the Imperial Republic of Shireroth which requires a three fourths’ majority vote of the Landsraad, the consent of three-fourths of the Imperial States, and the Kaiseress' promulgation of the aforesaid by Imperial Decree.

[Mira Raynora Major]

...an alignment I do not see occurring any time soon.

We must stop asking ourselves "How do we fix Shireroth?" No one knows. No one can even agree what the problem is, and for sure there are more than one: people are not as tight-knit, few primary citizens, the group of people is entirely different now and most of us have little direct connection to the original founders/pioneers, disinterest in the central government, disinterest in the states, a confusing and sometimes impenetrable culture, and so on.

I'm not going to try to speak for others, but for me the root problem is that we are simply not on the same page. Shireroth's strength is also its weakness: the diversity that makes it attractive to people of very different persuasions makes meaningful unity all but impossible. I would liken the present situation to an old married couple who wake up one morning and realise that they have almost nothing in common...and like many couples in this situation, Shireroth remains held together largely out of a combination of nostalgia, lingering loyalty and a fear of the alternatives.

I understand dissolving ourselves, national suicide in other words, might appear to some as dignified and graceful. I don't think that's how Shireroth should be ended. To be blunt if we were to end ourselves we should have done it long ago... Babkha went out at the right time, they saw themselves on a downward trend and no one wanted or cared to invest much into saving it. We've gone past that point, that to end now would be insignificant. Shireroth is like The Simpsons... its not the best anymore, and its a shadow of its glory days, but it's ok sometimes and some people still get some enjoyment out of it, and isnt that good enough?

While I understand the sentiment, I disagree on two points. Firstly, that isn't good enough for a number of people and that is why they are either leaving, or growing steadily less active. Secondly, I personally feel there are alternatives between the two extremes of ending it all or plodding on wearily with things as they are...and the perceived unwillingness to seriously engage with these alternatives is a large factor in my own frustration and malaise.

However, there HAS been a brain-drain, and two seemingly permanent schisms... first Kildare and now Minarboria. It does feel like those of us still primarily in Shireroth have been "left behind".

I question who is "primarily in Shireroth". I think it is unhelpful to speak of Kildare and Minarboria without also mentioning Stormark and Natopia, on the grounds that most of the people who aren't involved with former two are heavily invested in the latter pair.

Now unlike others, I'm not implying that there is anything unduly sinister in this. For me, the influence of foreign states is a symptom rather than a cause of our disunity; to phrase it another way, what we are seeing here is simply a continuation of the age-old tripartite division between Elwynn, Brookshire and Kildare...with Goldshire resting uneasily somewhere in the middle. These three communities, I would argue, are the true success stories of Shirerithian history; these cultural-ideological units keep resurrecting themselves, stubbornly refusing to die despite the best efforts of New Feudalism, the House System and the centralisers to reduce their prominence.

And that is why I passionate believe that the only sane course for Shireroth lies in recognising these ideological and political divisions within a wider Shirerithian cultural sphere.

[Fjorleif]

And that is why I passionate believe that the only sane course for Shireroth lies in recognising these ideological and political divisions within a wider Shirerithian cultural sphere.

My Lords and Ladies,

May I presume that the Queen of Lichbrook is referring to Elwynn, Lichbrook and Goldshire becoming independent countries?

[Mira Raynora Major]

Yes, but within a broader "Shirerithian Sphere"...possibly similar to the recently restored Diet of Cranda (I'm not too familiar with the details of this, but the I think the general concept may be heading in the right direction). I have always thought that Shireroth works better as a looser historical-cultural idea than as a unified political entity, so I would like to see the concept continued in a way that allows us to escape from the motivational impasse in which we appear- once again- to find ourselves.

Having said that, the nature of the states should depend on the wishes of the local inhabitants so I would prefer to talk in terms of "two or three culturally and ideologically coherent states", as that allows for some flexibility while focussing on the key intention: gathering like-minded Shirerithians together in communities that actually work well.

[Verion]

what we are seeing here is simply a continuation of the age-old tripartite division between Elwynn, Brookshire and Kildare...with Goldshire resting uneasily somewhere in the middle. These three communities, I would argue, are the true success stories of Shirerithian history

I would disagree. Perhaps for some specific people this might be the case, but in general I think it is an incorrect assesment of the current situation. To start with Elwynn, I think that it would be stretching it way too far to equate the current make up of the Elw society with the Elwynnese community as it was. Only Ric, and to a lesser extent myself, are left of what was the population of Elwynn when I arrived there some three years ago. Obviously Stormark has some ties to Elwynn, but I absolutely don't think that we can speak of a consistent Elw community that is now clearly defined. In fact, many people like me might be regarded as beloning to more communities. I regard Elwynn as my Shirerithian fatherland, but I might as well be associated with the Kildare community. On the subject of Kildare, it becomes even more clear that your statement doesn't hold ground. The current Empire of Jingdao cannot, and should not, be regarded as a continuation of the Kildare community as a whole. The only linking member is Jonas, whilst Rasmus and myself joined Kildare at point in time when the Kildare of old had already vanished.
I am not really too sure about Brookshire, since I don't know enough of it. But I don't see people like Krasniy, Edgard or Ryker as being part of that, so you can't really equate Brookshire to Minarboria either.

What has become very clear to me about Minarboria is that it is basically an attempt to refound Shireroth without the people that are disliked by prominent Minarborians. Or at least, their views on micronationalism are disliked. I am not criticising this wish of people to congregate with people who share similar ideas on micronationalism, or who generally like each other. But what I do criticise about Minarboria is that it essentially renders Shireroth obsolete. It is obvious that the Minarborians now spent their time doing stuff in Minarboria and not in Shireroth. What I don't understand in Mira's argument is that she doesn't adress the fact that activity in Minarboria takes away the development that could have happened in Brookshire. Why create another nation? Why not work within Shireroth?

I think the answer to that is that some people simply don't like Shireroth at the moment. It is clear to all that some Minarborians, especially Krasniy, and myself had a slight falling out. I also assume that the Stormarkisation of Elwynn isn't really appreciated. I think that those who chose to be active in Minarboria rather than Shireroth should be more open about what they are doing and why. After all, the cultural similarities between our two countries are more than striking.

Everything combined has lead me to believe that Shireroth might very well be unnessecary. Obviously the intent of this bill was to spark discussion, which I hope will go on for some time, since I am really interested in the reaction of some people from the other side.

[Malliki Nur Pinito]

Stop tinkering with everything all the time. Leave it be.

[Mira Raynora Major]

There is no "other side", Jack. The whole tenet of your argument seems to be "By creating Minarboria, you have killed Shireroth"...which I find rather far-fetched, not to say dismissive of the majority of Shirerithians who aren't and never have been involved with this other country. You want to discuss the future of Shireroth? I'll be happy to discuss that...as a Shirerithian.

[Jonathan]

Lady Praetor

I am glad that the matter has been put before us. It may strike a little odd to debate our very own suicide, but I think we very much need that.

Shireroth is directionless and Shireroth is not very much appreciated by either the State governments or its citizens. But deep down, there is a love for Shireroth, a loyalty.

I cannot say I know the solution. My own personal approach is just to stay and wait for better times. But what the Lichbrook government seems to propose, we could expand on.

We could dissolve Shireroth as a sovereign power, and replace it with a loose union based on the following points:

- Each state becomes an independent state, to be governed by a constitution decided by the state authorities prior to the independence

- Each state, for as long as it should exist as an independent state in the future, will be part of the community of Shirerithian states (with a better name of course).

- The figurehead (and powerless) title Kaiser/Kaiseress of Shireroth will rotate every 3 Elw years (or every 100 ASC units, depending on preference) between the heads of each state.

- Jingdao would be invited to join the community because of Kildare.

- "Mesopotamian" Shirekeep goes to Elwynn

- Each territorial government decides on its own future

- Any SCUE assets belonging to the Imperial Republic will be shared equally between the States


Now, is that what we would want?

I am not so sure.

[Kaiseress Kizzy]

Counterpoint: Give me absolute power. Make the Golden Mango Throne a force to be feared and reckoned with.

[Shyriath]

I think that those who chose to be active in Minarboria rather than Shireroth should be more open about what they are doing and why. After all, the cultural similarities between our two countries are more than striking.

For my part, I've mentioned my discontent and my basic reasons for it on a previous occasion, and I'm not particularly inclined to repeat myself on that score.

However, one of Rossheim's points here resonates rather strongly with me, and I don't believe I've addressed the particular matter before:

strength is also its weakness: the diversity that makes it attractive to people of very different persuasions makes meaningful unity all but impossible. I would liken the present situation to an old married couple who wake up one morning and realise that they have almost nothing in common...and like many couples in this situation, Shireroth remains held together largely out of a combination of nostalgia, lingering loyalty and a fear of the alternatives.

It's been a long, long time since I've felt that the affairs of the Imperial Government have mattered to me, longer still since I've felt I understood much of what was happening in the other States... and, I'll be honest, an extremely, extremely long time since I've felt anyone outside of Lichbrook cared much for what I was doing, except possibly Gloria Mundi and, for a shorter time, Shirekeep, neither of which I'm atill involved in. I haven't seen many non-exhausting ways to integrate my ideas and projects into anyone else's here, nor anyone else's into mine.

[Verion]

It's been a long, long time since I've felt that the affairs of the Imperial Government have mattered to me, longer still since I've felt I understood much of what was happening in the other States... and, I'll be honest, an extremely, extremely long time since I've felt anyone outside of Lichbrook cared much for what I was doing, except possibly Gloria Mundi and, for a shorter time, Shirekeep, neither of which I'm atill involved in. I haven't seen many non-exhausting ways to integrate my ideas and projects into anyone else's here, nor anyone else's into mine.

So, why keep Shireroth then? Seems you are on my side. It's clear you prefer Minarboria, and you should.

[Shyriath]

I await developments.

[Verion]

Honestly, I think that's a lame cop-out. You don't like Shireroth at the moment and you don't want to do anything about it.

[Mira Raynora Major]

What exactly are you expecting, Jack? It isn't up to Shy to "do something about Shireroth". He's been quite open and honest about how he feels on this matter, as have you, Kizzy, Malliki, Jonathan and I...but that still leaves a lot of people who haven't said anything and without taking into account where they stand, nothing drastic is going to happen.

[HIH Prince Daniel]

Sadly I believe this august and glorious Imperial Republic has run its course.

[Malliki Nur Pinito]

I think that you people (yeah, you people) need to decide once and for all: Either you commit to the continued existence of Shireroth, or you kill it. Those are the only two choices you have.

[Ryker]

*rubs temples* Ugh...